Here’s my supplement stack as it now stands. These may not be right for everyone, as they depend on many factors, such as age, level of activity, goals, and how well you do in other areas, such as exercise, diet, and sleep. These are not recommendations, so please do your research and read our disclaimer.
Morning sup stack
In the morning, a coffee with a dash of cream is usually all I consume for the first few hours of the day, sometimes longer. With my coffee, I take:
IP6, ~500 mg. It’s in bulk so measurement isn’t precise.
resveratrol, ~100 mg. Ditto.
berberine, 500 mg
vitamin D, 5000 IU – not every day though, as I believe 5,000 IU could be pushing upper limits. Say 4-5 days a week, less in summer when I get some sunshine.
vitamin K, ~1 mg. I don’t believe in taking the 5 mg capsule, so I open it and pour a bit in my coffee, and make it last a week.
aspirin, 80 mg (“baby” size). Read my article about aspirin; it probably makes sense only for certain people over age 50.
fish oil, 1 tsp., 3 days a week. I use cod liver oil. This is another supplement you don’t want to overdo.
Fasting
On a day when I do a 16-hour or longer fast, in addition to what I’ve already taken above, at mid-morning I may take:
niacin, 250 mg. Increases autophagy during a fast. More than 250 mg causes me intense, uncomfortable flushing, so I limit it to this.
Mid-Day and Dinner
I often don’t remember these, and I don’t consider them critically important, so that doesn’t bother me. But when I do remember — maybe a couple times a week, I take:
green tea extract, 400 mg. It has ~30 mg caffeine in it, so I don’t take it later than mid-day Update: I’ve stopped taking green tea extract due to reports of possible toxicity in high-dose users, which I discussed here.
curcumin, 500 mg. Not absorbed well at all unless with a high-fat meal.
Workout supplements
Once every three days I lift weights. On those days, after my workout I take:
whey protein, 20 grams.
creatine, 3-5 grams. I’ve become somewhat skeptical that creatine will help someone who already eats well. But it’s harmless at worst, and cheap, so… I take it.
Night stack
magnesium, 200 mg. Promotes relaxation.
lithium, 5 mg. Only a couple times a week maybe.
Supplements
Despite what you’ve read above, I’m skeptical about excessive supplement need. For example, I don’t take a multivitamin, nor do I take any sort of “pre-workout blast” or Lord knows what else they’re selling out there. Everything I take has solid scientific backing for efficacy.
I’m also skeptical of those who say you don’t need supplements. Maybe you don’t need them, but what’s optimal is another story. Most of the supplements I take are fairly cheap and provide insurance and just maybe some edge.
Mangan’s Supplement Rule of Thumb: The more expensive a supplement is, the less likely you are to benefit from it. (Nicotinamide riboside, for example.)
If you wanted to narrow this down, which ones are the most important? I’d say most people could benefit from magnesium and the appropriate amount of vitamin D.
All the supplements discussed above are listed on my supplements buying guide page.
47 Comments
Very helpful, many thanks!
Hey, Wolf – my pleasure.
thanks very much for this
One question:I recall you wote a piece aways back re Vit C,that it is bad for you. I think they said it didnt reduce oxidation but may increase it,something along those lines. I dont take it but its on my “someday I’ll tak ethis”list. Anyone have info on Vit C? Anyone….anyone…Bueller…
Yes, I’ve written about the uncertainty of vitamin C as supplement. I currently lean towards modest supplementation. See e.g. current post at top of blog, or search the blog for posts on C.
So grateful for this, dutifully retweeted, thank you.
Yes, thanks Dennis. I’d been wanting to ask you to put together such a post for a while, but never quite got around to it. It always felt a little presumptuous to ask.
You seem to be concerned with aging effects, may I ask how old you are? I occasionally send copies of your posts to my Dad, who’s in his early 60’s. (He doesn’t do the web, but has a kindle so I can copy text of blog posts and email them directly to his kindle.)
A couple things I’d like to add if I may:
Concerning Omega 3, I just today finished a lengthy article for Seth Roberts on my wife’s and son’s experience supplementing O3. It completely turned them around on some mental health issues, once they started taking a consequential dosage. We don’t eat any industrialized food and so I figured because of that we didn’t need very much O3. It was complete luck that I discovered it helped my son with some ADHD-like symptoms. (Watch for the story at Seth’s blog.) I think more people need to be aware of this aspect of O3.
Concerning K2, once I started taking that (1 drop of Thorne’s K2-MK4 twice a week) my teeth practically clean themselves. The difference is incredible. It’s the one and only vitamin I’ve taken that I can absolutely tell makes a physiological difference in me. Again, that was one I thought of being for heart health, and once I started taking it realized it was making an acute and almost immediate difference for my dental health. It took about 5 days to kick-in and feel the difference.
Also, one caveat on the K’s. I started out taking a version that was a mix of K1 and K2. It made my gums feel weird, which I thought was weird and hesitated to ascribe to the vitamin until I read somewhere on Stephen Guyenet’s blog that high doses of K1 can cause gum problems. Go figure. I switched to a straight K2 formulation and never had the issue again.
Thank you for the list! I know nothing about supplements. Since your list starts with whey protein, I thought I’d start there… but I don’t know where to begin. Concentrate? Isolate? Hydrolyzed? What goes in a whey protein shake, anyway?
My elderly mom is having issues with macular degeneration. Do you know if there’s anything good for aging eyes?
Good list and agree with everything, especially whey, its been so heavily marketed as a bodybuilding supplement when clearly its health benefits extend far beyond that. ( Ive actually considered investing in some whey producing companies since I expect demand for it to increase heavily in the future when more people realize its potential ).
BTW is Creatine worth the hype? Its one of the few things ive done almost zero research on and ive always just dismissed it as hogwash. Maybe I should take another look.
Thanks all, I enjoyed writing it, and glad you find it useful.
What about flaxseed oil? I have heard that is benefits men as a weak estrogen mimicker.
Flaxseed oil can be of benefit, but I wouldn’t think because of any putative estrogen mimicking effect. That strikes me as not of benefit.
When it comes to mimicking,I really like the work of Frank Gorshin. His Richard Widmark was spot on!
What a coincidence. My uncle was college roommates with Richard Widmark!
Nothing funnier than Kirk Douglas!
What about absorbing magnesium through the skin with an Epsom salt bath? Is that as good as or better than taking magnesium orally?
Short answer is I don’t know, but one would have no idea as to how much has been absorbed. That’s probably not that bad, but if one wants to be sure of repleting magnesium, seems to me orally would be the better way.
Gonna have to strongly disagree on fish oil and whey powder, and question resveratrol.
Whey protein powders are very highly oxidized. They inevitably have a lot of toxic crap in them that stresses your body. Whey protein is super good. Drink milk and eat cottage cheese. But do not use protein powders; they are all crap.
Fish oil trials show strong benefits for various inflammatory diseases. This is because N-3 oils are *immunosuppressive*! They also lower metabolic rate. Fish oil can help in the short term but will inevitably hurt and contribute to premature aging in the long term. The N-3 fats accumulate permanently in tissue over time and are linked to cancer. You want to eat as little unsaturated fat as possible (both N-3 and N-6), and address inflammation problems by fixing metabolism, not with immunosupression.
Resveratrol is a very questionable supplement. It is essentially a phytoestrogen. It seems to negatively affect insulin production, cell division rates, and mitochondria respiration. Depending on your ideas about physiology these are all bad things. Mice experiments with resveratrol show they lose endurance and strength on it. If resveratrol does anything at all in a human I would lay money it does bad things.
BTW, asprin is a highly potent aromatase inhibitor. If I had any signs of excess estrogen I would go for a one cent aspirin tablet before anything fancier.
Just so the reader can evaluate some of Joe’s claims:
https://digressionality.blogspot.com/2013/11/resveratrol-augments-benefits-of.html
https://digressionality.blogspot.com/2013/11/resveratrol-protects-against-physical.html
https://digressionality.blogspot.com/2013/06/resveratrol-increases-lifespan-in.html
https://digressionality.blogspot.com/2013/11/resveratrol-doubles-sperm-count-and.html
No evidence given for claims about whey powder. Yes, fish oil can be immunosuppressive at high doses; that’s what countering inflammation is all about, and why I said that if one’s diet is good, only minimal amounts are needed.
Thanks for your comment, Alan. In fact, I’m not much younger than your father. However, I’ve been interested in anti-aging for quite some time and one reason I find it of great importance is because aging predisposes to virtually every disease. In my book I noted the similarities between chronic fatigue and aging, for instance in mitochondrial function, inflammation, and oxidative stress.
Certainly there are many cases in which one would want to increase omega-3 intake. Dr. David Perlmutter (who wrote the current bestseller Grain Brain) recommends something on the order of 4 or 5 teaspoons a day for Alzheimers’ prevention. (I’d have to go back to find the exact figure.) I don’t know whether that applies strictly to high risk groups or whether he means everyone.
Interesting about K2. I can’t say that I’ve noticed a marked difference from taking it.
Note re Perlmutter:On Amazon a man who ID’d himself as a doctor wrote a review in which he castigated Perlmutter for cherry picking the research to get the results he wanted. I’d read him with care. As the saturated fat debate has shown, scientists are right up there with mortgage brokers when it comes to honesty and reliability!!!
Ozarkian: Not too much difference between whey isolate and concentrate, the former is is almost pure protein, the latter maybe 90%, the difference being a gram or two of carb/fat. So either one is fine. Hydrolyzed is more for those who want fast absorption, mainly bodybuilders, and even they don’t really need that, IMO. Most whey is formulated with an artificial sweetener, although you can get it plain too; a whey shake is just whey mixed with water usually.
Macular degeneration seems to be related to oxidative stress, so whey and NAC may be helpful there. And don’t neglect diet – see my comment about industrial food.
Kindke, creatine really has been studied to death and really does work, though its effects seem greater in groups that need more of it, such as vegetarians and older people.
Zinc itself is also an aromatase inhibitor. Lots of whey products are mixed with soy, not to mention the cows the stuff is derived from are pumped full of hormones. Grass fed whey is the way to go if you care about those kinds of things.
Onion juice I’ve also heard is a good free radical chaser and a T booster, but I haven’t tried yet.
Re zinc as aromatase inhibitor, I hadn’t heard that so I looked around a bit. From what I can find, it appears that only in cases of zinc deficiency will adding zinc affect aromatase. This is similar to zinc’s T boosting effect: if your zinc replete, adding more zinc doesn’t do much of anything. The reports of zinc affecting aromatase I found were anecdotal and on bodybuilding forums. (If you have a legit source, I’d be interested in it.)
As for whey, I’m not aware of and haven’t used any products mixed with soy. Of course what the cows themselves eat matters, but grass fed whey is awfully expensive. Grass fed beef is better too but I don’t buy it ’cause of expense.
That’s where I found the zinc info too. Makes sense too about the whole depletion thing because there was a time when I masturbated a lot (now stopped) and when I took zinc then the effects were far more noticeable, now not so much.
Yeah that’s what I meant in regard to soy, it’s not uncommon for the cattle to be fed the stuff, get more bang out of the buck when it’s put in their feed as it were. Grass fed whey is expensive but I just minimize costs in other areas and only use it on work-out days. Same thing with beef.
Great post by the way, I bookmarked it for reference.
I apologize if this is the third time you see this comment, I think the last two attempts failed.
I take whey protein, creatine, multivitamins and fish oil capsules. I started taking fish oil capsules after you tweeted some study that showed that Omega 3 increase muscle protein anabolism.
In this article you wrote to avoid fish oil capsules. Can you give a reason?
After looking for a reason myself I stumbled upon this article https://www.nbcnews.com/health/mens-health/fish-oils-may-raise-prostate-cancer-risks-study-confirms-f6C10597283
Now I’m a little concerned. Any truth to it?
What would be better Omega 3 source if I would switch from capsules?
Thank you!
Mitja, fish oil capsules are more readily oxidized, as they’re exposed to air and warm temperatures (e.g. on store shelves) for a long time. That’s why I say to avoid them.
As for fish oil linked to prostate cancer, I agree that this is something to be kept in mind. (I’m in no position to say what the “truth” is, I just read and try to figure things out.) We need to look at the balance of evidence, which changes constantly. There’s a fair amount of evidence, for instance, that high omega-3 levels in the blood are associated with the lowest risk of heart attack. (Look up “omega-3 index” for that.) Anyway, I don’t discount this study you cited, and I’m going to look further into it.
I immediately came across this: https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/808402
“The bottom line is that we cannot determine from this study design whether the intake of omega-3 fatty acids will cause prostate cancer and raise a man’s risk for high-grade disease. The media has taken this and sensationalized the risk associated with omega-3 fatty acid intake, but I believe that the attention is overplayed and the concerns about the study design were not mentioned at all. At the end of the day, this study does not prove that intake of omega-3 fatty acids causes prostate cancer or increases a man’s risk for high-grade disease. We would need better-designed trials that are prospective and randomized to be able to make such a claim. Until that is done, we will have to weigh the pros and cons of taking omega-3 fatty acids in terms of its other potential health benefits to decide what to do. Whether it causes prostate cancer is not determined by the results of this trial. I look forward to your comments.”
In your research and personal experience, have you found that creatine monohydrate is adequately absorbed by the body or is there a superior form?
Based on what I’ve read, there’s no difference in that regard between types of creatine. I have however read that there may be some concern with purity; apparently some types (brands) have a high fraction of toxic contaminants, and since the dose is grams daily, that can be significant. NutraBio which I noted above makes a 99.95 pure form as do others, and it may be worthwhile to ensure that you get pure creatine.
I assume you know of Examine.com? Great for supp recommendations.
Thanks for this. Good list. I’ve been taking 7/10 of these, but will look into the others.
You left out a big one: caffeine. Particularly if you don’t normally drink coffee, tea, coke, etc. A little before a workout definitely gives you a boost.
Yes. I guess I figured that since I get caffeinated every day and before every workout, everyone else does too. Essential for good gym sessions.
I would like to recommend two leading edge candidates for your future consideration :
Astralagus at maximum refined state such as TA65 or Stem Cell 100. Longevity and telomere protection.
Carbon 60 in olive oil : incredible anti- oxidant far superior to anything out there
Is broccoli or cauliflower a AI?
Why not hemp protein instead of whey? Far far superior.
I’ve been purchasing supplements from nutritionexpress.com for about 30 years; since before the internet when they were a catalog company. The prices are outstanding and the customer service has never let me down.
A few years ago a blood test revealed that my kidneys were unhealthy due to elevated level of creatinine. My doctor had me quit the creatine for a couple of months, then retested me twice. My creatinine level was back to normal and no kidney disease as I already knew. I asked the doctor if the elevated creatinine level could cause actual kidney disease, but he seemed to dodge the question. So I don’t know if using creatine just causes a false positive, or if it is truly harmful. I do know it helped my strength and muscle density gains.
Test propionate or test enanthate?
Mangan, great post – any recommendations for or thoughts on supplements for joint health?
AFAIK, supplements targeted at joints, like glucosamine, don’t work – though glucosamine extends lifespan, so it’s healthy. Osteoarthritis seems to be caused by inflammation, so anything that fights that, which is just about any healthy practice, should help joints. That being said, I’ve just told you almost everything I know on that topic, so there may be things I have to learn.
Thanks – that’s exactly what I was looking for. Lifters seem to favor not using much to fight inflammation in case it interferes with your body’s own feedback system, e.g. that you can take aspirin as an AI, but be careful it does not hinder your ability to know you’re hurting yourself. If your shoulders are hurting, maybe lay off the military presses for a bit; if knees, maybe lay off squats for a bit, etc. But this looks like an area where supplementing specifically isn’t really beneficial. Thanks
I loathe Kindles… I was given one and destroyed it. It was so irrational it deserved to be pounded into a pile of shards and twisted metal leaves. I would vote to torture its software engineers as well. Once you go MAC everything else is worse than dumb. The book, however, is good.